Race Change Discussion

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Ricewind
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Re: Race Change Discussion

Postby Ricewind » Sun Feb 21, 2016 12:56 pm

"The issue for me is mainly, the looks"

No offence, but If you ask me, this is a bad argument to request change, especially something pretty drastic as this.

It would be the same as saying, I like how weapon x looks but it's weak, please make it better.

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Blade Takehiko
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Re: Race Change Discussion

Postby Blade Takehiko » Sun Feb 28, 2016 3:28 pm

Masterforce wrote:Perhaps i'm the only person who thinks this way, but I find that race/gender difference a very important aspect of the game. I like how the races/genders are setup. I really like who has what, it makes allot of sense really and it plays into the storyline of the game itself. I'm sure its possible to change this, but I wouldn't want to.

I'm sure most of the changes will stay, but the huge differences in tech damage make it impossible to play as
a tech based class if your a cast or beast.
The blade that once cut the wings of a devil.
Kento Twilight Beast lvl1 Fighgunner[Clementine]
Argus Kelgron Beast lvl1 Masterforce[Clementine]
Roland Beast lvl1 Acrofighter[Clementine]
None lvl???? Demigod[Unknown?]

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Miyoko
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Re: Race Change Discussion

Postby Miyoko » Mon Dec 26, 2016 10:52 pm

I'm inclined to agree with the "don't fudge them" crowd. At least, don't fudge with them too much. A small buff here or there, but the game makes it pretty clear what a certain race excels at. Homogenization brings things closer together, but the closer everything is, the less flavour everything has. That's part of the fun of the game, I think.

Except gender bonuses. That's super "whatever", and the lack of any in game indication it's a thing just makes it worse.

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Blade Takehiko
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Re: Race Change Discussion

Postby Blade Takehiko » Thu Dec 29, 2016 12:46 am

I agree that Racial differences are a very important aspect of the game, my only issue is Casts being more superior than beasts when it comes to Melee based classes. For whatever reason, Sega thought it was best to make beasts strong, but miss 50% of there attacks all the time. Casts being second in melee, and top tier in accuracy makes them ideal of both melee and gunning, and usually, they tend to out DPS Beasts. Thats a fact. As their nanoblasts are pretty much useless after lvl 40. My only suggestion is the ability to boost their accuracy for melee based classes. If S4~S8 is going to be a thing. Then making sure your attacks hit is a very big issue.
The blade that once cut the wings of a devil.
Kento Twilight Beast lvl1 Fighgunner[Clementine]
Argus Kelgron Beast lvl1 Masterforce[Clementine]
Roland Beast lvl1 Acrofighter[Clementine]
None lvl???? Demigod[Unknown?]

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Noblewine
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Re: Race Change Discussion

Postby Noblewine » Thu Dec 29, 2016 1:14 am

Beast have nanoblast which gives them variety. One nanoblast increases accuracy temporarily until your time limit ends.
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Seority
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Re: Race Change Discussion

Postby Seority » Thu Dec 29, 2016 1:47 am

Blade Takehiko wrote:...my only issue is Casts being more superior than beasts when it comes to Melee based classes.

I agree with you here, and I have a few suggestions on how to level the playing field. If CASTs ATP were lowered, and beasts ATA hightened, this might help the issue.

Also we must consider defenses when talking about S4+ missions. It's hard to put things into place logically when it comes to PSU, but I'll try anyway.

I feel beasts, while having top strength and health, should fall short on defense next to a CAST who are partly mechanical afterall. However, CASTs should be weak in evasion and staminia. I like to think of a bear vs a tank for some reason lol.

There's plenty more things to consider as well. Maybe buffing up nanoblasts so that they can compete with CASTS more so. Even though I believe you should be efficient playing either a melee CAST or beast, CASTS shouldnt be top tier for everything aside from technics.
Last edited by Seority on Thu Dec 29, 2016 9:32 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Blade Takehiko
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Re: Race Change Discussion

Postby Blade Takehiko » Thu Dec 29, 2016 5:07 am

Seority wrote:
Blade Takehiko wrote:...my only issue is Casts being more superior than beasts when it comes to Melee based classes.

I agree with you here, and I have a few suggestions on how to level the playing field. If CASTs ATP were lowered, and beasts ATA hightened, this might help the issue.

Also we must consider defenses when talking about S4+ missions. It's hard to put things into place logic when it comes to PSU, but I'll try anyway.
I feel beasts, while having top strength and health, should fall short on defense next to a CAST who are partly mechanical afterall. However, CASTs should be weak in evasion and staminia. I like to think of a bear vs a tank for some reason lol.

There's plenty more things to consider as well. Maybe buffing up nanoblasts so that they can compete with CASTS more so. Even though I believe you should be efficient playing a melee CAST or beast, CASTS shouldnt be top tier for everything aside from technics.


It just feels that way, I mean, they only have 3 class bonuses for the core melee classes, newmans have what... 5 now? humans have a bonus in almost everything which is fine, but I also dont agree with the insane buffs humans are also getting. the issue will be the same, Humans will out DPS a beast in melee due to accuracy being so close to casts. I get hybrids are built for humans. But in terms of melee based DPS. Beasts should come out on top no matter what. Its how they're meant to be. Casts are superior with guns. but it doesnt mean the cant melee. And humans are the jack of all trades. they should be almost equal to the second best. stat that each class supports. So hybrid bonus or not, they should never past casts in terms of strength Especially since they have the 2nd best TP. if anything. be almost identical in strength, but not quite.. in JP humans were DAMN good, So i seriously dont think they should be buffed TOO much above that without considering a buff for every character to keep the balance stable. depending if gas will ever be a thing or not. you need to take into consideration about those stat bonuses aswell. Also take into consideration that Humans and newmans recieved SUVs in JP, which just gave them that extra edge over beasts too.

Its makes it a bit unfair about those newmans
how can most classes be able to master in 2 attack focuses, but newmans suffer in HP DFP and strength? atleast make them slightly weaker in STK than humans, or give them their basic human buffs. Remember, Karen was a melee based newman, and PSO1 +2 You always see that Female newman being melee.
it'll atleast make them more capable as a gunner or something.

End the in, We dont want all Races to be similar, but we wanna keep them in the same focus as their description states. People also need to take into consideration that not everyones going to read the changes, Hell, i'm sure 90% of the community doesnt know that the gender differences are changed. This probably wouldnt be an issue if master classes had more variety. Lol.
The blade that once cut the wings of a devil.
Kento Twilight Beast lvl1 Fighgunner[Clementine]
Argus Kelgron Beast lvl1 Masterforce[Clementine]
Roland Beast lvl1 Acrofighter[Clementine]
None lvl???? Demigod[Unknown?]

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Miyoko
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Re: Race Change Discussion

Postby Miyoko » Thu Dec 29, 2016 7:40 am

I think Sega was banking on Beasts attacking from behind to avoid the whole ATA issue. Massive attack, but the trade off is you have to be more aware of your positioning, which I think is a perfectly acceptable trade off. It's not that hard to bum-smack things.

Which reminds me, has that been implemented yet? I've been pewpewing mostly so I haven't reaaaally noticed, but it feels like it? Could be lag futzing with it?

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Seority
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Re: Race Change Discussion

Postby Seority » Thu Dec 29, 2016 9:53 am

Blade Takehiko wrote:... I also dont agree with the insane buffs humans are also getting. the issue will be the same, Humans will out DPS a beast in melee due to accuracy being so close to casts ... in JP humans were DAMN good...

As far as my knowledge goes, humans won't, nor should out DPS beasts in melee based classes. They should, however, do better DPS than beast as a hybred class. It's not about the weapon type here, it's about the class type.

Also, I've heard from people who played on the JP server that barely anyone played human. So, if they were "so broken," why was there so few?

Blade Takehiko wrote:Its makes it a bit unfair about those newmans how can most classes be able to master in 2 attack focuses...

I understand your plight here, since yes, newmans are pretty much seen as TECHNIC users only, yet there needs to be more you consider beyond damage. Maybe we can give other advantages to newmans (or any other race for that matter) that make them appealing to play. How about raising their pp regen? Giving them more evasion or mp, so they can be tanky, in a different way. Maybe giving them bonuses to certain weapons, like daggers and bows?

You're right, there are many things to think about when it comes to balancing the races, but we should add up more than just damage output.
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Midori Oku
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Re: Race Change Discussion

Postby Midori Oku » Fri Dec 30, 2016 10:38 am

At this point there is really no point in changing the races since we have Japanese content. Humans and Newmans will have specials, and Nanoblasts will be updated to what they were before JP PSU closed.

Edit: As for Humans not being used on JP, that is about as far from the truth that you can get. If I'm not mistaken they were actually the 2nd most used race. There was a website that had the percentages of the races and genders used before JP PSU closed, but I can't find it.


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